LEARN TO COUNTER | RSS | IRC

Author Topic: Transgender Starcraft 2 players  (Read 9918 times)

squarepusher

  • Arranged Team Scrub
  • Level 12 on Halo: Reach
  • *****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« on: March 21, 2013, 12:28:51 AM »
Has anyone else noticed that it seems like many top SC2 gamers are transgender now?
Apparently Scarlett and Leiya(puck) are both out now, I wonder if this is just a normal statistical population trend % or if there is any correlation beyond that

http://www.reddit.com/r/transgamers/comments/10fr4t/professional_starcraft_ii_gamer_puck_recently/

So this struck me an an interesting development, or maybe just previously top gamers didn't want to come out or felt the climate was not right, and todays society is more accepting?
Europe was founded in 1848 by Walker Texas Ranger when he rode a horse across the Atlantic, he called it "Eastern USA" which was eventually abbreviated as just "EU"

Shoggy

  • One-Credit-Cleared Farmville
  • *****
  • Posts: 5050
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2013, 12:38:22 AM »
Has anyone else noticed that it seems like many top SC2 gamers are transgender now?
Apparently Scarlett and Leiya(puck) are both out now, I wonder if this is just a normal statistical population trend % or if there is any correlation beyond that

http://www.reddit.com/r/transgamers/comments/10fr4t/professional_starcraft_ii_gamer_puck_recently/



I think it is an anomaly.

Quote
So this struck me an an interesting development, or maybe just previously top gamers didn't want to come out or felt the climate was not right, and todays society is more accepting?


I think society is more accepting of transgender people than it was 10 years ago but all this really shows is that the SC2 community is different than say the MW community.
Quote
Everything human is pathetic. The secret source of Humor itself is not joy but sorrow. There is no humor in heaven.
- Mark Twain, Following the Equator

Quote
Kill yourselves.

- Proto Cloud

Evilagram

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1027
  • Vi veri universum vivus vici
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2013, 07:23:53 AM »
I'm presuming MtF, not FtM.

squarepusher

  • Arranged Team Scrub
  • Level 12 on Halo: Reach
  • *****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2013, 11:25:30 AM »
I'm presuming MtF, not FtM.


Yeah, this was it, also there was a bit of controversy that I believe they were playing in "Iron Lady" SC2 womens tournament, and Scarlett won the tournament recently, and is also currently in the top 3 rankings
http://www.nationalesl.com/us/ironlady/halloffame/

So should it be fair that a MtW gamer is allowed to play in female only tournament?  In normal sports, there is a usual clear physical advantage that males have, like in football height, weight, muscle etc.  In e-sports, is their a level playing field?  Or does one gender have an advantage?  Typically esports are dominated by males, but is this due to just interests or an actually innate skill difference?
Europe was founded in 1848 by Walker Texas Ranger when he rode a horse across the Atlantic, he called it "Eastern USA" which was eventually abbreviated as just "EU"

Boredom

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1226
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2013, 11:57:44 AM »
Only tranny ESPORTS player I know of outside SC2 is Kayo Police of the Japanese SFIV tourney scene, who didn't come out about it for quite a while. Of course, she wasted no time in whoring herself out in semi-nude photo shoots afterwards.

Surth

  • Arranged Team Scrub
  • Number Munchers Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 795
  • Itin√©rant
    • View Profile
    • "Surth, update your blog from time to time!" - "sod off, i'm masturbating!"
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2013, 12:05:06 PM »
n=2

Evilagram

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1027
  • Vi veri universum vivus vici
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2013, 12:11:46 PM »
So should it be fair that a MtW gamer is allowed to play in female only tournament?  In normal sports, there is a usual clear physical advantage that males have, like in football height, weight, muscle etc.  In e-sports, is their a level playing field?  Or does one gender have an advantage?  Typically esports are dominated by males, but is this due to just interests or an actually innate skill difference?
\

Now that is an interesting question. In regular sports, the divisions exist because of genetic differences in muscle building, and if they didn't exist then women would be completely ineligible.

I wrote an article on female gamers that I was going to publish on GYP, but it was deemed unpublishable by the head of the site. Big trend I noted is, girls do not perform well at games compared to their male peers. Very few in ANY field ever outperform their male peers.
https://www.evernote.com/shard/s204/sh/c4b02d85-f224-4a48-843e-0d6ad7ede5d3/b411ada928dd3cdc6d8dfdcb4f6dabb2
Does this trend point to an innate skill difference, or is it just because girl's are disinclined?

I think this is a topic worth investigating.

Heromann

  • Most Valuable Poster
  • Angry Birds Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 248
  • Baaaaaaallllllllllllllinnnnnnnnnnnn
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2013, 12:35:43 PM »
I have no substantial evidence to back this up except for many years of porn.  Here is my theory:

Asian nations boast a large number of transgender individuals due to toxins from improperly regulated industry.

Cynical

  • Arranged Team Scrub
  • Level 12 on Halo: Reach
  • *****
  • Posts: 272
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2013, 01:29:48 PM »
\

Now that is an interesting question. In regular sports, the divisions exist because of genetic differences in muscle building, and if they didn't exist then women would be completely ineligible.

I wrote an article on female gamers that I was going to publish on GYP, but it was deemed unpublishable by the head of the site. Big trend I noted is, girls do not perform well at games compared to their male peers. Very few in ANY field ever outperform their male peers.
https://www.evernote.com/shard/s204/sh/c4b02d85-f224-4a48-843e-0d6ad7ede5d3/b411ada928dd3cdc6d8dfdcb4f6dabb2
Does this trend point to an innate skill difference, or is it just because girl's are disinclined?

I think this is a topic worth investigating.
The University of Texas did a study a few years ago that showed that testosterone affects reaction to losing in a game.

High testosterone tends to make someone want to go back and try again after they lose.  Low testosterone leads someone to want to "cut their losses" and walk away.  Oddly, it doesn't seem to change how people react to a win.

Now, think about competitive gaming, and what it takes to do well.  It takes losing a lot

Evilagram

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1027
  • Vi veri universum vivus vici
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2013, 02:02:57 PM »
That is true. I still am unsure of whether we can draw serious conclusions from that alone though. I think I might do an investigation of it when I have time.

Centrophy

  • Angry Birds Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 80
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2013, 03:15:29 PM »
Yeah, this was it, also there was a bit of controversy that I believe they were playing in "Iron Lady" SC2 womens tournament, and Scarlett won the tournament recently, and is also currently in the top 3 rankings
http://www.nationalesl.com/us/ironlady/halloffame/

So should it be fair that a MtW gamer is allowed to play in female only tournament?  In normal sports, there is a usual clear physical advantage that males have, like in football height, weight, muscle etc.  In e-sports, is their a level playing field?  Or does one gender have an advantage?


Maybe, the Williams sisters certainly dominate in Women's Tennis.

Evilagram

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1027
  • Vi veri universum vivus vici
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2013, 04:48:15 PM »
That's a sport separated by sex, and they are not transgender.

Centrophy

  • Angry Birds Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 80
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2013, 06:55:23 PM »
That's a sport separated by sex, and they are not transgender.

You lie on the latter part of your statement. They're certainly built like men, I wouldn't be surprised that it comes out that they were in fact formerly men.

Noobshock

  • Most Valuable Poster
  • Number Munchers Legend
  • *
  • Posts: 859
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2013, 07:44:37 PM »
Holy fucking shit I care more for nyan cats and the democrat party platform than this kind of debate/thread/shit.

There's a GIANT thread about being gay and playing Starcraft on TL. What. The. Fuck? People have TIME to argue about this shit?

I mean, does your sexuality influence the way you're playing a motherfucking RTS? Do we really have to hear about how hard it is to play SC when you're a faggot? Gay activism, #1 at making sure anyone reasonable finds homosexuals really fucking obnoxious.

If you want me to leave this forum just make sure to keep a giant thread about LGBT rights in gaming active.

Boredom

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1226
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2013, 10:21:30 PM »
Quote
I mean, does your sexuality influence the way you're playing a motherfucking RTS?
No, but it may affect a gaming community's acceptance of you and your ability to participate in said community.

I remember reading about a Quake tournament that had enough complaints about harassment directed towards female players that they just banned all women instead of actually attempting to resolve the issue. Also, a black female SFIV player in the US called BurnYourBra who had to put up with a ton of shit unrelated to the game at tourneys (although she was kind of asking for it with that name).
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 10:24:32 PM by Boredom »

squarepusher

  • Arranged Team Scrub
  • Level 12 on Halo: Reach
  • *****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2013, 10:33:39 PM »
Holy fucking shit I care more for nyan cats and the democrat party platform than this kind of debate/thread/shit.

There's a GIANT thread about being gay and playing Starcraft on TL. What. The. Fuck? People have TIME to argue about this shit?

I mean, does your sexuality influence the way you're playing a motherfucking RTS? Do we really have to hear about how hard it is to play SC when you're a faggot? Gay activism, #1 at making sure anyone reasonable finds homosexuals really fucking obnoxious.

If you want me to leave this forum just make sure to keep a giant thread about LGBT rights in gaming active.


gaydar detected.  Just kidding, but wow that TL thread has 329 pages now :o

It seems to be that females may be less competitive, and more team oriented?  So they may gravitate more towards games likes WOW than a 1v1 type game like SC2.
Europe was founded in 1848 by Walker Texas Ranger when he rode a horse across the Atlantic, he called it "Eastern USA" which was eventually abbreviated as just "EU"

Noobshock

  • Most Valuable Poster
  • Number Munchers Legend
  • *
  • Posts: 859
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2013, 11:42:35 PM »
No, but it may affect a gaming community's acceptance of you and your ability to participate in said community.

I'm sure if you were a flamboyant fag that spoke with a lisp and matched just about every stereotype, people on skype/ventrilo etc would get tired of you pretty quick. Would it be because you're gay? I think it's just because the person we're talking about here is just annoying as fuck to listen to for extended periods of time, kind of like thugs speaking ebonics, the gays have their own moonspeak that as an english speaker, I don't really care to engage in. Nobody is going to "accept you for who you are" if you're just an annoying piece of shit. I don't think a homosexual that does not fall within that cliche would have a problem playing video games.

Now I don't like flamboyant fags any more than any other group of people who behaves super extravertedly and basically amounts to extra environmental pollution. When you make a conscious effort every day to dress to show off your pride of belonging to such and such minority, to speak loud so you make it clear for everyone, etc etc, you're just being a giant walking pile of unwarranted self-importance. Typically all you're doing is trolling anyone who has better things to do such as work a real job and take care of a family. Now thanks to America 2.0, most people don't have real jobs (trades, skills, whatever) and/or don't even care to have a family because it's too much responsiblity/too hard/the planet is overpopulated so let's let the mexicans/arabs/chinese breed while we don't this-is-sure-to-solve-the-problem. So instead of doing things that matter a large segment of the population can parade around to show everyone just how much they're gay and proud, or ghetto and proud, or metal and proud, or god knows what other dumb shit people find pride in in this day and age. And inevitably one day the power structure comes crashing (too much debt will do that, but it's cyclical anyway) and the country falls back on those usually quiet people who work real jobs and have families instead of supporting all this dead weight of bullshit pride paraders and their bubble-supported jobs that bring jack and shit to anyone. And then the power structure can't protect all these attention whoring turds anymore because it just doesn't have the energy and resources to even give a shit. And that day, they go back to their holes and hide or they burn.

<3

Boredom

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1226
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2013, 12:15:21 AM »
I'm pretty sure I didn't say anything about any of that, man.

My friend (who happens to be gay) is pretty introverted, and certainly doesn't make a show of his sexuality, but has still always had a tough time interacting with hetero males besides his brother and me because he comes across as feminine and has that voice. This led to him developing a rather sad verbal auto-defense mechanism where he never gets confrontational and always laughs at everything. It's often a much more subtle thing than you claim.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2013, 12:18:36 AM by Boredom »

Noobshock

  • Most Valuable Poster
  • Number Munchers Legend
  • *
  • Posts: 859
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2013, 06:08:56 AM »
This defense mechanism has nothing to do with being gay in particular, it has to do with lacking self-confidence at large and happens to hetero males often enough that I've known a few. And no, they weren't all closet gays lol.

Now if you want to say his lack of self-confidence has to do with being gay, that may be possible, however I really doubt your friend is being bullied into it. Gays aren't exactly stoned in the streets, or even mocked very much anymore since everything is so locked with political correctness. Hell when I was a kid I was mocked over many things, some of them hurtful some of them less, but kids bite man, that's just part of how you grow up, and gays don't have it any worse than the fat and slobby kids in school.

I'd say your friend is just shy and/or hasn't emotionally matured very much yet. Sexual orientation has little to do with it tbh.

Evilagram

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1027
  • Vi veri universum vivus vici
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2013, 09:20:07 AM »
My little brother is gay, he has none of the flamboyant traits mentioned.

And holy christ that post is discriminatory.

Noobshock

  • Most Valuable Poster
  • Number Munchers Legend
  • *
  • Posts: 859
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2013, 09:56:40 AM »
My little brother is gay, he has none of the flamboyant traits mentioned.


Yes, it's a cliche, maybe I need to google the meaning of the word cliche for you.
I'm glad your little brother doesn't fall into that category. If his priorities are in order he's probably not spending his life worrying about minority rights, because as far as I know there are no laws discriminating against gays in the United States and he can go on about his business without being worried about being discriminated against by the state or being harmed by 99.99999% of people since it's just as illegal to physically harm a homosexual as anyone else. Now if he's asking everyone to "like" and "support" gays as a "lifestyle", then I'm afraid no amount of government coercion is ever going to comfort him. There are always people who don't like you or what you represent, including when you're white male and heterosexual.


Die Cis Scum


Really, how long do you think this kind of shithead lasts in the real world without a government to treat him like a special snowflake to be protected?

Shoggy

  • One-Credit-Cleared Farmville
  • *****
  • Posts: 5050
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2013, 04:52:42 AM »
Quote
I wrote an article on female gamers that I was going to publish on GYP, but it was deemed unpublishable by the head of the site.

I thought that was a well written article. Why did the head of the site reject it? O_O

Quote
So instead of doing things that matter a large segment of the population can parade around to show everyone just how much they're gay and proud,

Well, in modern culture your sexual orientation is considered to be another aspect of your personal identity. If a group people are experiencing  prejudice and discrimination because of who they are of course they are not going to remain silent.

Quote
and gays don't have it any worse than the fat and slobby kids in school.

They do here in the deep south because conservative Christians are the majority. Adults often forget the whole "love your neighbor as yourself" aspect of Christian morality when it comes to these issues and with kids it is even worse because kids are assholes.

Quote
I don't think a homosexual that does not fall within that cliche would have a problem playing video games.

Obviously you have never been on xbox live.
Quote
Everything human is pathetic. The secret source of Humor itself is not joy but sorrow. There is no humor in heaven.
- Mark Twain, Following the Equator

Quote
Kill yourselves.

- Proto Cloud

Evilagram

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1027
  • Vi veri universum vivus vici
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2013, 10:05:01 PM »
I thought that was a well written article. Why did the head of the site reject it? O_O

He said, "how is this video games"

And another contributor said, "I think the broader idea Tim was trying to portray is that it might not be a good fit for our site. Even though I've read the article and agree with much of the message (putting aside the editing it requires), GYP doesn't feel like the proper place for this. I can already see the comments section filled with readers dropping the site because we dared to even bring up the topic, regardless of what side it takes.

It's a powder-keg. I think we shouldn't be playing with fire around it."

I'm personally not terribly happy about dropping the subject (I asked about the article idea I had in this thread and I was told again it was unpublishable) and I think it could bring a lot of attention to the site to have a fair and balanced view on the subject broadcast. It is a problem because feminists have made it out to be a problem that girls are not equally marketed to and represented in games and gaming. Gaming is the field of power and they want in on it. This however is problematic because it may be the case that women still do not take to games and remain a minority, let alone dead weight in the community. It may create a witch hunt for sexist policies or attitudes that don't exist and only have the appearance of existing from a lack of female representation. Or alternatively, there may be an actual problem with men, which leads to men feeling like they're being persecuted and I'm viewed as some manner of white knight for accusing them and so on and so forth.

fucking powder keg.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2013, 10:19:21 PM by Evilagram »

Noobshock

  • Most Valuable Poster
  • Number Munchers Legend
  • *
  • Posts: 859
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2013, 09:15:58 AM »
Does this trend point to an innate skill difference, or is it just because girl's are disinclined?

I just noticed this.
It's both obviously, and they're self-reinforcing.
There is an innate skill difference having to do with levels of testosterone in relation to competitiveness, and typically that has the consequence of having girls care a lot less about competitive gaming.

But yes genetics obviously play a part. You can't just brush off thousands of years of evolution and gender specialization. Well some people think they can, they're just insanely arrogant.

Evilagram

  • Number Munchers Legend
  • ***
  • Posts: 1027
  • Vi veri universum vivus vici
    • View Profile
Re: Transgender Starcraft 2 players
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2013, 02:09:13 PM »
http://games.on.net/2013/02/study-women-harassed-in-games-up-to-three-times-more-than-men/

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/my-brilliant-brain-make-me-genius/

I decided to watch the gamer girl panel at PAX that happened within the last hour and quite frankly, it's hard to deny that they have a lot of a point. We need to find a common ground that is equitable for all parties and force everyone to stick to it.

 

links